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 Issues within the overall flow of the game

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Tajifun



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Registreringsdatum : 2014-04-08

PostSubject: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:37 pm

I would like to adress some issues that have recently come up.
With the last patch the flow of the game got severely hurt and something has to change a keep a vital game experience.

I'm level 40 in my 3rd rerbirth now, so I guess I know how the flow of the game goes after playing it almost 4 times (pre- and post-patch)

So let me try to explain what these issues are and how to possibly fix them. Feel free to discuss.


-- 1. Make arrows less expensive --
Reasoning:
Buying arrows is the only alternative to playing with a sword since the amount of arrows you get every minute was decreased.
However, buying arrows is way to expensive to do consistently.
It takes away a lot of your money denying many other opportunities (such as buying houses, a full set of high-level equipment,
having enough money for a rebirth book at the end of one episode)
So: You are forced to play with a sword.
Playing with the sword is not a bad idea in itself, however, it has some issues to it:
-> Since you have to come close to the monsters to damage them you will lose hp sooner or later
-> This will leave you with 3 possibilities:
1. Die
This was not a problem before (expect one cared about the death counter)
but due to the recent change that causes you to lose exp each time you die, this is definitely not a valid option anymore.
2. Buy potions
Funnily enough, this brings us back to the previously mentioned concern of why to change arrows.
While not being as expensive it still adds up. Furthermore potions in early episodes do only heal you for small amounts.
3. Take a rest
This is possibly the best thing one can do right now.But sadly, it does take away all fun, lots of your motivation to keep playing for a longer period of time
and does not grant you anything buy the feeling a getting more and more annoyed.
Running back to the restguy every time you're about to die,
even if you did not even kill 1 monster so far because there were a couple of them at one spot is not that much of a great experience.

=> In other words, randomly killing monsters (leveling) is not worth to do, neither is it fun to do.
My suggestion: Either make the arrows be more easily affordable, or make the potions be more cheap. There is also the possibility to create some other sources of health-regain:
- Regeneration, Spells, Life-stealing items (just to give some spontaneous ideas - would make the game more diversified und fun)
Anyway, this leads us to the other thing you could do besides leveling: questing

-- 2. Undo the changes to the quests and monster-respawn timer --
Reasoning:
Now that we know that leveling is an option at the moment what else is there to do?
One of the most unique features I have seen so far: A proper Quest-System.
However, the recent changes (increasing respawn-timer + amount needed to finish a quest) made this be no option, either.
Previously questing was you killing a boss (at leats in most cases), then waiting for it to respawn. Within the time of waiting you had nothing other to do but leveling - obviously.
Now that you cannot do that anymore it leaves to wait for the boss to respawn. As you might guessed right here the respawn-timer and the monster-amount come into play.
Time to actively play the game got replaced by afk-ing (waiting for the monster to respawn) and since it does take you even more monster for a single quest now it becomes even worse.
Any movation to keep playing gets completely destroyed.

=> In other words, questing has just become a kind of waiting for the boss to respawn, which takes away all of the fun and motivation.
My suggestion: Undo the changes to the boss-quest no matter what and lower the respawn timer to at least 3 minutes. Furthermore, increace the difficulty of killing bosses.
By making them be more challenging it will be way more fun to kill them and you archieve the same effect of making the quests harder to finish. This could be done by giving them some attacks that have an actual impact,
because right know most of them are useless (if they even have one).


-- 3. Lower teleport price --
Reasoning:
This is gonna go really quickly. They are straight up waaay to expensive.
There is no reason to use one whatsoever (expect you have a house in a certain episode or want to sell stuff) since this rpg is episode-based and now open-world based.
Have never seen anybody use them.

=> My suggestion: Make them really cheap, since they don't offer much use anyway or even free to use.

-- 4. Slightly adjust the prices of each episoed equipment --
Reasoning:
While the early equipment sets are veeery easy to pay, the further you go, the more expensive it gets. This is not neccessarily a bad thing, since it offers you a little bit of testing room in the beginning of the game
and forces you to make decisions of what to buy later on.
However, this gap is a little extreme in my opinion.
While playing I felt like: holy crap this is realy cheap, while other parts of the game (previously mentioned) are way to expensive)

=> My suggestion: Put some of the price of other things in here. Make the cost of episode 2-3 equipment (possibly even ep. 4) a little higher.



3. - 4. are just things that came to my mind whilst playing. However, they are not in desperate need to change.


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Angelz

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PostSubject: Re: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:42 am

+1
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PostSubject: Re: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Tue Apr 29, 2014 10:36 am

Tajifun wrote:
I would like to adress some issues that have recently come up.
With the last patch the flow of the game got severely hurt and something has to change a keep a vital game experience.

I'm level 40 in my 3rd rerbirth now, so I guess I know how the flow of the game goes after playing it almost 4 times (pre- and post-patch)

So let me try to explain what these issues are and how to possibly fix them. Feel free to discuss.


-- 1. Make arrows less expensive --
Reasoning:
Buying arrows is the only alternative to playing with a sword since the amount of arrows you get every minute was decreased.
However, buying arrows is way to expensive to do consistently.
It takes away a lot of your money denying many other opportunities (such as buying houses, a full set of high-level equipment,
having enough money for a rebirth book at the end of one episode)
So: You are forced to play with a sword.
Playing with the sword is not a bad idea in itself, however, it has some issues to it:
-> Since you have to come close to the monsters to damage them you will lose hp sooner or later
-> This will leave you with 3 possibilities:
1. Die
This was not a problem before (expect one cared about the death counter)
but due to the recent change that causes you to lose exp each time you die, this is definitely not a valid option anymore.
2. Buy potions
Funnily enough, this brings us back to the previously mentioned concern of why to change arrows.
While not being as expensive it still adds up. Furthermore potions in early episodes do only heal you for small amounts.
3. Take a rest
This is possibly the best thing one can do right now.But sadly, it does take away all fun, lots of your motivation to keep playing for a longer period of time
and does not grant you anything buy the feeling a getting more and more annoyed.
Running back to the restguy every time you're about to die,
even if you did not even kill 1 monster so far because there were a couple of them at one spot is not that much of a great experience.

=> In other words, randomly killing monsters (leveling) is not worth to do, neither is it fun to do.
My suggestion: Either make the arrows be more easily affordable, or make the potions be more cheap. There is also the possibility to create some other sources of health-regain:
- Regeneration, Spells, Life-stealing items (just to give some spontaneous ideas - would make the game more diversified und fun)
Anyway, this leads us to the other thing you could do besides leveling: questing

-- 2. Undo the changes to the quests and monster-respawn timer --
Reasoning:
Now that we know that leveling is an option at the moment what else is there to do?
One of the most unique features I have seen so far: A proper Quest-System.
However, the recent changes (increasing respawn-timer + amount needed to finish a quest) made this be no option, either.
Previously questing was you killing a boss (at leats in most cases), then waiting for it to respawn. Within the time of waiting you had nothing other to do but leveling - obviously.
Now that you cannot do that anymore it leaves to wait for the boss to respawn. As you might guessed right here the respawn-timer and the monster-amount come into play.
Time to actively play the game got replaced by afk-ing (waiting for the monster to respawn) and since it does take you even more monster for a single quest now it becomes even worse.
Any movation to keep playing gets completely destroyed.

=> In other words, questing has just become a kind of waiting for the boss to respawn, which takes away all of the fun and motivation.
My suggestion: Undo the changes to the boss-quest no matter what and lower the respawn timer to at least 3 minutes. Furthermore, increace the difficulty of killing bosses.
By making them be more challenging it will be way more fun to kill them and you archieve the same effect of making the quests harder to finish. This could be done by giving them some attacks that have an actual impact,
because right know most of them are useless (if they even have one).


-- 3. Lower teleport price --
Reasoning:
This is gonna go really quickly. They are straight up waaay to expensive.
There is no reason to use one whatsoever (expect you have a house in a certain episode or want to sell stuff) since this rpg is episode-based and now open-world based.
Have never seen anybody use them.

=> My suggestion: Make them really cheap, since they don't offer much use anyway or even free to use.

-- 4. Slightly adjust the prices of each episoed equipment --
Reasoning:
While the early equipment sets are veeery easy to pay, the further you go, the more expensive it gets. This is not neccessarily a bad thing, since it offers you a little bit of testing room in the beginning of the game
and forces you to make decisions of what to buy later on.
However, this gap is a little extreme in my opinion.
While playing I felt like: holy crap this is realy cheap, while other parts of the game (previously mentioned) are way to expensive)

=> My suggestion: Put some of the price of other things in here. Make the cost of episode 2-3 equipment (possibly even ep. 4) a little higher.



3. - 4. are just things that came to my mind whilst playing. However, they are not in desperate need to change.



good Post Razz
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BurnyPenguin
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PostSubject: Re: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Tue Apr 29, 2014 1:17 pm

Before I post it, let me introduce myself. My ingame name is BurnyPenguin and I'm lvl 42 in Lunia. I have a full function GM commands but I don't use it often because I also want to be a regular player like you. . =)

--1 I totally agree this is a very good post, We made it more and more difficult when getting to a higher level. That's why we made the equipment in ep 1 is much easier to afford. However, the monster stats is made for the previous episode gear. The boss is meant to be a hard challenge and you'll need the episode gear to defeat them, but you can also be able to kill a boss in a previous episode gear.  We won't change the equipment of ep 2-3 and 4. but we'll maybe make ep 5 and 6 slightly cheaper .

--2 Undoing the monster timer may be impossible because we did it to reduce lagg. Otherwise we all will get about 300-500 ping. This is a large tibia with alot of new features. If you remember the first time you played Lunia, you had to download over 1000 files aye? To those who have rebirthed.

--3 We never thought of to add an teleport, so we created a horse called Knight horse. The horse is for traveling very fast. However if you want to be cheaper. We'll maybe do it. (Same with potions and arrows).


Regards//BurnyPenguin
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Tajifun



Antal inlägg : 4
Registreringsdatum : 2014-04-08

PostSubject: Re: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:03 pm

TheUnknown wrote:
Before I post it, let me introduce myself. My ingame name is BurnyPenguin and I'm lvl 42 in Lunia. I have a full function GM commands but I don't use it often because I also want to be a regular player like you. . =)

--1 I totally agree this is a very good post, We made it more and more difficult when getting to a higher level. That's why we made the equipment in ep 1 is much easier to afford. However, the monster stats is made for the previous episode gear. The boss is meant to be a hard challenge and you'll need the episode gear to defeat them, but you can also be able to kill a boss in a previous episode gear.  We won't change the equipment of ep 2-3 and 4. but we'll maybe make ep 5 and 6 slightly cheaper .

--2 Undoing the monster timer may be impossible because we did it to reduce lagg. Otherwise we all will get about 300-500 ping. This is a large tibia with alot of new features. If you remember the first time you played Lunia, you had to download over 1000 files aye? To those who have rebirthed.

--3 We never thought of to add an teleport, so we created a horse called Knight horse. The horse is for traveling very fast. However if you want to be cheaper. We'll maybe do it. (Same with potions and arrows).


Regards//BurnyPenguin

-- 2:
By "undo the changes" I was refering to the increase of the time it takes a boss to respawn (3min -> 5min if I recall correctly).
Same goes for the quest-changes.
Increasing the amount of monsters it takes you to finish a quest was ment to make the quest more challenging.
However, it made the quest (which is one of the most unique features) become boring.
Furthermore, depending on whether you're playing while waiting for a boss to respawn or afk-ing, the whole quest system got less relevant.
For example:
I just made my way up from level 40-50 by killing the boss I need for my quest and randomly killing monsters in ep. 5 in the meantime.
Since the recent patch increased the amount of times that I need to kill the boss from like 6 to 12 the I was waiting for it to respawn obviously made a jump up (twice as long). So I spend that time leveling and ended up finishing the first quest of episode 5 at level 49. This should definitely not be the case. It takes away all sense of the quest because the next episodes exp-gain is way higher anyway so there is no need to stick around in the previous episode and keep finishing it's quests.

Therefore: Reduce the amount of bosses needed for a quest or the quests will be useless, not worth doing and boring. If you want to make the quets more challenging give the boss a little boost in power (eg. a special attack or maybe just some stat boosts)

-- 3:
I was refering to the teleport that can be used within a city by stepping on it. It was way to expensive for the little use it offered. Either it was my fault, describing badly or the teleports are so useless that you didn't even realised they exist :p
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BurnyPenguin
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PostSubject: Re: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Thu May 01, 2014 9:15 am

-- 2: I also play Lunia without using commands... (except teleport to player to talk with them)
       I too, think boss respawn takes too long, that makes me AFK sometimes and waiting every 3 minutes. So I agree with out that boss respawn takes long time.

-- 3: It wasn't that I haven't realized teleport exist.. Let me tell you a story. Long time ago, when we got help from Thomas Yates to host our server, in that time we didn't thought of making a teleport, instead we made a Knight's horse for people to travel. but we haven't seen so many to use it so we made the teleport. In order to not make Knight's horse useless, we had to make it very expensive.

Teleport: From 1300=>2300=>3300=>4300=>5300=>6300 now costs 800 to every episode

PS: And Yates didn't wanted to host our server anymore, that's why Lunia were off in 2 years.. Now we've found another ally called Infinity to host our server. We still can host one more server. Hope you can choose which server you want.
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PostSubject: Re: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Fri May 02, 2014 10:06 pm

BurnyPenguin wrote:
-- 2: I also play Lunia without using commands... (except teleport to player to talk with them)
       I too, think boss respawn takes too long, that makes me AFK sometimes and waiting every 3 minutes. So I agree with out that boss respawn takes long time.

-- 3: It wasn't that I haven't realized teleport exist.. Let me tell you a story. Long time ago, when we got help from Thomas Yates to host our server, in that time we didn't thought of making a teleport, instead we made a Knight's horse for people to travel. but we haven't seen so many to use it so we made the teleport. In order to not make Knight's horse useless, we had to make it very expensive.

Teleport: From 1300=>2300=>3300=>4300=>5300=>6300 now costs 800 to every episode

PS: And Yates didn't wanted to host our server anymore, that's why Lunia were off in 2 years.. Now we've found another ally called Infinity to host our server. We still can host one more server. Hope you can choose which server you want.

Good, im think to like that
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Promaster

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PostSubject: Re: Issues within the overall flow of the game   Sat May 03, 2014 1:05 am

PS: Infinity server is ending up with us. Infinity clan is splitting up. So I have to host my god damn own server!

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Long Live Lunia!

///All Regards Promaster
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